Forum:Admiral divisions
Ok, so I've got a problem. I'm doing some more work on the rank pages as a whole, and I've got some issues that I'd like to work out regarding the divisions of admirals. In ENT, the Admirals always wore red/white. TOS showed admirals wearing both Command and Operations colors. TMP's system only allows for admirals to wear Command uniforms, but allows them to wear any of the shoulder boards. Movie ranks always showed Admirals with the base color of white, aka Command. TNG/VOY showed Admirals with mostly Command red, but one with Operations yellow, but the DS9 uniforms only showed red. What I'm debating is whether to delete all of the extraneous images which couldn't possibly be Admirals or keep them anyway. I deleted all of the TMP ones, because there's no way an Admiral would be a Technician or a Non-Bridge Personnel. The only one that fits is Command. But the other ones are ambiguous. I'd obviously keep TOS the way it is, but I want to know what you guys think before I start deleting stuff that isn't obvious, like the TMP ones. My question to you is: Should the Admiral ranks here be limited to what is possible, ie, what has been seen on screen? --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 01:34, 24 December 2006 (UTC) :No one has ever mentioned any constraints on STEU including information based from non-canon sources -- i don't think its a great path to follow. While the ENT system seems to be an exception, if other uniform eras have shown multi-divisional admirals, i say keep them -- TOS, TNG and the Movies have all shown admirals with other divisions, this is more than proof enough for me. -- Captain M.K.B. 05:34, 24 December 2006 (UTC) ::Ok, so we're agreeing on the ENT ones, right? I should remove the extra ones? --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 05:37, 24 December 2006 (UTC) :::Actually, I've got a better idea. I think it's completely reasonable to assume that all Admirals and Fleet Admirals, ie the two highest grades, are going to be Command, since they're the highest grades. What if I remove the extraneous Admiral and Fleet Admiral grades and leave the extra divisions for VADM and below? --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 05:39, 24 December 2006 (UTC) :There is one uncertainty on the (TNG four-pip) Admiral grade -- a lot of people assume that Admiral McCoy might be a full admiral, and thus a science division admiral. -- Captain M.K.B. 05:48, 24 December 2006 (UTC) ::maybe just the FADMs then, command only? -- Captain M.K.B. 05:50, 24 December 2006 (UTC) :::The only problem is that we never found out what grade of Admiral McCoy was and he didn't wear any comparable insignia. "Admiral" can be short for any of the five grades. Considering his age and the fact that he wasn't wearing a uniform, I'd say his grade of "Admiral" may have been honorary, considering that out of all of the former Enterprise major crew, he was the only one available to inspect the new Enterprise. Kirk was dead, Spock was being an ambassador, Scotty was stuck in a transporter, Sulu was probably at Starfleet Command and Chekov and Uhura were doing who knows what. --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 06:02, 24 December 2006 (UTC) ::::Still, wouldn't you say that its "better safe than sorry" to at least include the sci div ADM insignia? -- i'm willing to admit i know of no FADMs in canon, noncanon or fandom that are anything but command -- but i'm just still not sure about the ADMs. the "maybe" of Mccoy (we never found out what grade of Admiral McCoy was and he didn't wear any comparable insignia) -- still exist. -- Captain M.K.B. 06:07, 24 December 2006 (UTC) :::::Ok, leaving FADMs as command only sounds fine. So it's: #Set ENT ranks as Operations only #Remove all non-command FADM ranks Am I right? (Even if so, I'd like to wait to get some more members' opinions on this. Two users deciding on something like this isn't very Wikilike.) --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 06:10, 24 December 2006 (UTC) ::sounds ok to me. i;ve got to admit thats how i did it with my own rank graphics. other users, i'd be glad to hear from -- Captain M.K.B. 06:12, 24 December 2006 (UTC) :A very minor note here, DS9 did show one Operations division Admiral, Toddman, in "The Die Is Cast". Your plan of action sounds good to me. --TimPendragon 07:07, 24 December 2006 (UTC) ::Toddman was a VADM, so he wouldn't violate the changes. --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 07:08, 24 December 2006 (UTC) Anyone else have something to say? --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 17:57, 24 December 2006 (UTC) :Kevin asked me to comment; all I can say is I'm fine with whatever y'all decide. Removing extraneous clutter (as long as it's unneeded) is usually my preferred course of action. 20:26, 24 December 2006 (UTC) I'm going to go ahead and do it, and if anyone objects, I can always reupload the images. --Kevin W. Adm•Tlk 21:10, 24 December 2006 (UTC)